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Maxirad
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Should government schools be outlawed in the United States?
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JimG
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Public schools teach the established public religion, which has no place for God.
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gam197
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Trump promised to do away with the public school but whether that was even possible who knows.
There is no way that the public schools will lose power, too much money and power in the teacher’s union.
We have known for the last fifty years what the problem is but have been unable to do anything about it.
The only two groups that have made inroads are the Muslims and Hasidic Jews in NYC who seem to be able use public money in their public schools.
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Freddy
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A clumsily written and confused article which contradicts itself:
'All the data suggest that, by and large, kids brought up in religious households stay religious and kids who aren’t, don’t. ’
Yet…
‘Childhood religiosity was heavily affected by government spending on education and, to a lesser degree, government spending on old-age pensions’.
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StudentMI
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I agree it’s not a great article. However I am completely for abolishing public schools. As the leftist communist Pier Paolo Pasolini to the right winger Murray Rothbard have shown, government schools are merely a means to inculcate dominant powerful interests and subservience to the state into children.
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HerCrazierHalf
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In CA private schools average $11k for elementary and $20k for high school. Even with vouchers, that is a lot of money to cover the balance. How do you propose families pay?
Also, given the plethora of denominations and dissent among members, I’m not sure how a private school would nurture a given faith while attracting enough students to be profitable.
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StudentMI
Guest
What you are talking about is a distortion of the market mechanism due to state inference and regulation. Barriers to entry drive up prices.
As to how families pay in a free market, the answer is simple. Go elsewhere.
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HerCrazierHalf
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There cannot be a completely free market as bad actors will abuse it. Given that the market is education and safety of children, it seems some regulation is required.
I used to work at a high school. We often had difficulties calling parents due to their phone lines being cut for nonpayment. “Go elsewhere” will end up being public schools since schooling is mandatory.
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StudentMI
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You are again operating within a statist economy with regulation erecting barriers to entry.
There can be an approximation of free markets, which the Church is in favor of. Bad actors abuse and do more damage through statist economies, far more so than free markets recognizing property rights.
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HerCrazierHalf
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Which barriers/regulations do you suggest we eliminate/relax? The requirements for California do not seem onerous. Mainly criminal background, registration, and safety among other things.
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StudentMI
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And requirements.
Let me ask you this. 5 businesses spring up in territory x. The market is free and the businesses compete in providing services to the public.
Suddenly, the government of territory x decides that all businesses operating within the territory must operate according to law y. What is the immediate effect?
By the way, it’s odd you chose that part of my post to quote. Are you denying state coordinated economies are capable of far more harm than open governments and economies?
Let me ask you this. 5 businesses spring up in territory x. The market is free and the businesses compete in providing services to the public.
Suddenly, the government of territory x decides that all businesses operating within the territory must operate according to law y. What is the immediate effect?
By the way, it’s odd you chose that part of my post to quote. Are you denying state coordinated economies are capable of far more harm than open governments and economies?
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HerCrazierHalf
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Why was law y implemented? More often than not, it’s to curb the activities of a bad actor when market forces are incapable or too slow to do so quickly. For example, there is a cap on the maximum APR for payday loans. The market cannot reasonably limit rates as the costumers often have no other choices.
I’m denying that moderate regulation = state coordinated. I’m suggesting that current labor markets and such push private schools beyond low to mid income families, especially in urban areas with higher land costs.
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merida321
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If I ever have kids I want to homeschool them for reasons like this 
Like my awesome mom did!
Like my awesome mom did!
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Freddy
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Do you see any difference when the state is conservative and when it’s left leaning? I’d be interested to see some examples. You surely don’t mean that any all states simply want you to be subservient. That smacks of paranoia and you certainly don’t seem the paranoid type.
And you could also explain why private interests couldn’t be accused of exactly that which you are accusing the state. What’s to stop them being nurserys for religious or political extremism?
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Everest
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As an outsider (not American) I just googled and see that 90% of the schools in the US are public schools.
Can you tell me how your question makes sense??
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gam197
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Financially that is almost impossible first to have the children and second to homeschool them and that is built into the system. As a Catholic, you learn to fight for your faith. I hope you get your chance to homeschool.If I ever have kids I want to homeschool them for reasons like this
The right-leaning have been fighting to abolish schools for fifty years while the left supports and controls them.
I had a friend say, it took the Jewish people 400 years to get out of slavery and there may be some truth to that.
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Peeps
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Our city in Northern Illinois has the 4th highest property taxes in the United States.
In our city, around 63% of our property taxes goes to the public schools.
The rest is divided between police, fire, EMTs, the jail, streets and maintenance, trash pickup, the Park District (one of the Top Three in the nation!), and the city government (salaries, buildings, business supplies, legal, etc.).
Considering that our population has decreased by around 30,000 people in the last 20 years, does it make sense that public schools get 63% of the taxes, while ALL THOSE OTHER worthwhile and necessary services get 37%?!
So our public schools must be among the best in the nation, right?!
Wrong.
Only 15% of our public school students achieve GRADE LEVEL on the various standardized tests that are given every year. I will write that number out so that you won’t think I made a typo–FIFTEEN PERCENT! Only 15 out of 100 students are achieving grade-level skills in our public schools.
50% of our African American young men drop out of high school. A small percentage find their way back in their 20s to our alternative high school (gives people a second chance to finish their degree), but most end up unemployed, on welfare, or worse–in street gangs and/or involved with criminal activities.
Oh, but it must be because the teachers are paid a pittance, right?
A first-year teacher in our city has a starting salary (with benefits, plus all weekends, holidays, and summer off) of around $60,000. I make a salary slightly higher than that–after 31 (thirty one) years of work!!!
I absolutely agree that public schooling in the United States should be ENDED and replaced with a system of online schooling (for those students who do well with this method), private schooling (secular and religious options), and home-schooling.
One thing the pandemic has demonstrated is that we don’t really seem to need schools for children to either stall out (as 85% do in our city even when schools are in session) or do well. I could see developing a top-notch religious school curricula that is taught in a combination of online, parental (or any adult relative), or church-based settings.
In case you are wondering, my daughters attended a private secular country-day school–the historical concept behind this school was attendance from 7:00 a.m. until 5:00 p.m., with education including not only academic subjects, but also the arts, sports, and practical skills. Those hours were pretty much the norm for my daughters, although as figure skaters, they were not able to be at the school by 7:00 a.m. (which was voluntary, but many students came in that early to be able to study with each other, work on projects, work out in the gym, or get extra tutoring from the excellent teachers).
75% of the business and companies in our city are owned and managed by graduates of that school.
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Peeps
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Oh–I forgot to say it–pay for the private, online, and homeschools with the 63% of property tax monies that are currently being wasted paying for sub-par and failing public schools.
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Gorgias
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So… where do low-income families go, then?
And when the ‘regulation’ ceases, you’ll have a system of ‘haves’ and ‘have-nots’. Guess which schools will have the marginal faculty? The ones that charge more, or the ones that charge less?
You’ll implicitly cause a system of segregation. Is that what you’re advocating?
Still doesn’t mean that you’ll have a “student’s paradise”. Even if you get rid of state control, won’t you still have teachers’ unions? And if so, how will you change the dynamic that it’s expensive to pay teachers?!?
The implication is that it should be allowed to become a purely private system. Sell off the public schools to private interests and let them run them.
(Pretty naive, if you ask me.)
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