Purgatory

[po18guy]

Why not begin the conversation with one of the most misunderstood and disputed of Catholic doctrines?
1. It is only for the saved.
2. It is not a "place"
3. It is not a "second chance"
4. It is not permanent.
5. It is the very manifestation of God's love and mercy.
6. It is "biblical" for those who desire written proof.

 

[HomeschoolDad]

Thank you for posting this, and getting a good conversation started.

One thing worth noting, is that even if someone (such as a Protestant) doesn't believe in purgatory, they still go there too, if they die with something less than mortal sin on their soul. I've heard that some Protestants implicitly believe in a type of "settling-up" (as one Lutheran put it to me), even if they don't call it "purgatory". And then there is the concept, held by some Orthodox, of "celestial toll houses", where demons accuse the newly-reposed soul of various species of sins, and angels (and the prayers and suffrages of the faithful in this life) refute these accusations and try to get the soul toward heaven. That would have to be something mystical or learned through some kind of private revelation, because it's nowhere in Scripture, nor, so far as I am aware, in any traditional teaching of the undivided Church of the first millennium.

Jews also believe (and I'm probably going to garble this) that when you die, your whole life is reviewed for you, bit by bit, and how you lived is compared with how you should have lived, and the knowledge of this creates a "burning" within you, similar to how you blush and become heated and flushed when you are highly embarrassed. This is supposed to last about a year (in terms of time on this side of eternity). Jews have the concept of yahrzeit, literally, "year's time", where the faithful are commemorated on the one-year anniversary of their death.

 

[po18guy]

The pre-Christian thought of sacrificial offering and prayers for the dead bear witness that there is a process after death. That, "sins might be fully blotted out" of those who died a godly death, but yet having committed some sin. 2 Maccabees 12:39-46.

 

[St.Cono]

The concept of Purgatory both terrifies me and gives me hope at the same time. At my age, I am trying my hardest not to rack up any more mortal sin. I know that they can be absolved in the confessional, but that the temporal punishment must be dealt with in Purgatory. It's the unknown amount of time that this will take, to be purged, which frightens me. I wonder if we're cognizant in Purgatory as to how long we're going to be there. Would it be better to know, or to not know? Will we be aware of the passage of time there, and how close we're getting to our release? I guess only God knows. I worry about silly things like this though.

 

[po18guy]

The concept of Purgatory both terrifies me and gives me hope at the same time. At my age, I am trying my hardest not to rack up any more mortal sin. I know that they can be absolved in the confessional, but that the temporal punishment must be dealt with in Purgatory. It's the unknown amount of time that this will take, to be purged, which frightens me. I wonder if we're cognizant in Purgatory as to how long we're going to be there. Would it be better to know, or to not know? Will we be aware of the passage of time there, and how close we're getting to our release? I guess only God knows. I worry about silly things like this though.

When we receive a penance, we often risk dismissing it as frivolous, almost inconsequential. At best, we know part of our guilt; God knows fully. What we miss in our perception is that the light penance we receive is evidence - if not proof - of God's mercy. The foundation for this is the thought that, without God's mercy, we would long ago have been suffering in the flames we have earned. But yet, we are not! Each breath we take is a direct gift of love. The Lord brought us to life and sustains every moment of it. He is patient, will that no one perish.
Purgation is spiritual surgery, excising the tumor; the malignancy that we have brought upon ourselves. Yet, knowing that we have been judged worthy, and with absolute assurance that we shall soon enjoy eternal Beatitude, is not any level of pain almost inconsequential by comparison? Best to suffer s penance in the here and now, as God permits it within a framework which we can comprehend and relate to the temporal nature of our lives.
Prayer takes only so much time. Restitution takes only so much money. All penance is in time and that time will come to its end. We know when our obligation is fulfilled. That is the source of the hope we have. In contrast, Purgatory seems open-ended, undefined, nebulous. It may seem daunting, frightening, even horrific. Yet, we must always and everywhere be mindful that this very process, this very state, originates in God's infinite desire that we spend eternity with Him.
First, fear of death is conquered. After that, and fear of purification is pacified, such that purgation is desired.

 

[Cloisters]

"Remembering the Light" by Baptist Christian Rosemary Thornton tells of her temporary death experience. Her salacious husband completed suicide in their kitchen, in front of the dog. His previous indiscretions caught up with Rosemary as she required surgery. After said surgery, she began hemorrhaging, and bled out to the point of cardiac arrest.

According to her experience, her late husband is in "Restoration" for 10k earth years. The sun is expected to burn out then, so he's in Purgatory until the end of the world. I told her we can pray for him, but she said she can't. What she does is say, "I send you love". I told her, "That's prayer."

Rosemary is also known as the Sears Homes Lady. She has a separate website for "Remembering the Light". Just Google her name, and the videos will be listed.

Blessings,
Cloisters

 

[HomeschoolDad]

"Remembering the Light" by Baptist Christian Rosemary Thornton tells of her temporary death experience. Her salacious husband completed suicide in their kitchen, in front of the dog. His previous indiscretions caught up with Rosemary as she required surgery. After said surgery, she began hemorrhaging, and bled out to the point of cardiac arrest.

According to her experience, her late husband is in "Restoration" for 10k earth years. The sun is expected to burn out then, so he's in Purgatory until the end of the world. I told her we can pray for him, but she said she can't. What she does is say, "I send you love". I told her, "That's prayer."

Rosemary is also known as the Sears Homes Lady. She has a separate website for "Remembering the Light". Just Google her name, and the videos will be listed.

Blessings,
Cloisters

I hate to have to bring this into it, but the sun is going to last a whole lot longer than ten thousand years, according to science.

But it is interesting that a Baptist would admit of a purification after death. Their usual claim is that a person goes immediately to heaven after death, no kind of purification needed, so long as they've accepted Jesus as their Lord and personal Savior.

 

[Cloisters]

One of the homeschooling moms asked another at co-op about someone getting out of Hell. I didn't want to get involved, though. We were the only Catholics in a sea of Protestants.

10k years is what I've always heard.

 

[HomeschoolDad]

One of the homeschooling moms asked another at co-op about someone getting out of Hell. I didn't want to get involved, though. We were the only Catholics in a sea of Protestants.

10k years is what I've always heard.

Do you mean 10K years is what you've heard about purgatory, or about the sun burning out?

According to science, the sun will run out of hydrogen in about 5 billion years, but that is the same science that posits the age of the earth at 4.5 billion years. Young earth creationists would, of course, challenge both. I am not a young earth creationist (though I can't say it's impossible, God can do anything), but neither do I blindly accept what modern scientists say, first of all, they're always changing their minds and projecting new time frames.

Neither do I believe in evolution that just spontaneously happened and unfolded over a time frame of 3 to 4 billion years. I find it far easier to believe in an intelligent designer, a "God of the gaps". Evolution takes more faith to believe in than creation does. If you've ever looked at even the simplest cell, it's too complicated to have assembled itself together, it had an intelligent creator.